The Best Markets For Single Family Investments

[00:00:00] Navigate the Market and provide the tools and insights to build your real estate portfolio.

[00:00:07] Samantha, thanks so much for joining us here today. This is actually the second episode

[00:00:14] we're doing on your report because it was just so good. So we've already done an episode

[00:00:19] where Dan and I have gone through and read some of it and distilled down some information

[00:00:25] but it was such a great report and we cover a lot of reports here on the podcast.

[00:00:30] It was such a great report that we wanted to have someone who had put panda paper

[00:00:35] and done some of the research and been involved in putting it together.

[00:00:39] So why don't we start things off by having you tell us and the audience

[00:00:43] a little bit about yourself, your background in real estate

[00:00:46] and maybe what you do over at Cushman and Wakefield?

[00:00:49] Sure, well I've been in this industry in some capacity construction building real estate for over 30 years in Texas

[00:01:01] and now 25 years in Toronto which doesn't seem like it but time flies.

[00:01:07] That certainly does.

[00:01:10] I've had various roles in this career construction management, architect designer, project management

[00:01:17] and most recently joining Cushman and Wakefield to lead their strategic consulting group.

[00:01:23] And my group oversees portfolio analysis, site selection, workplace strategy, change management,

[00:01:33] large scale real estate strategy, asset strategy whether it's buildings or land.

[00:01:37] We look at economic strategies, attraction and retention strategies for municipalities and or developers etc.

[00:01:44] So we kind of have a pretty broad service line under my umbrella

[00:01:49] and I am in charge of Canada nationally and as of January I'm also in charge of consulting for the US.

[00:01:56] Wow, awesome. Amazing. She got a lot of free time on your hands.

[00:02:02] And obviously especially qualified to discuss, you know, I know in the report you discuss comparing and contrasting the sort of,

[00:02:10] I'm reluctant to use the word financialization of housing but you know the institutional investment in single family residential housing that we're seeing in the US

[00:02:19] that the report talks about that we're, you know, and makes a case for potentially seeing in Canada.

[00:02:24] So could you tell us a little bit about, you know, what compelled the you and Cushman to write this report and what it covers if you could sum up the key points?

[00:02:33] Well I want to take credit for the initial idea which came from our multi-family experts in the US.

[00:02:41] Of course they've seen a lot of investment in the US in institutional rental housing grow over the last 10 years.

[00:02:48] Pretty much explode especially across the Sun Belt states where it's cheaper to build.

[00:02:52] And you know they approached me and said hey does this idea really work for Canada? Let's explore it.

[00:02:59] So we partnered with them on this report. They have an expert who contributed the report. She's my co-author Christina, she's fantastic.

[00:03:08] And my team did a lot of the research in Ontario. I mean I think we could do the, well that's next steps but anyway we could do the whole report across Canada.

[00:03:16] I think it'd be quite interesting.

[00:03:18] Perfect. We're waiting for that.

[00:03:20] I would love to do that. I mean the idea was to look at Ontario being the most popular, you know, province and we're of course.

[00:03:25] Of course.

[00:03:26] The work of housing and rental housing is in extreme short supply so you know just to look at see if this was something that would be advantageous for institutional developers.

[00:03:36] We know that there's a lot of, I call them mom and pop but they're not really mom and pop you know they're usually you know one two three.

[00:03:43] So it's a group of investors at own 10, 15, 20 houses that exist already and that's you know a pretty thriving business.

[00:03:50] But the idea of institutionalizing what be to put you know more of not only an investment strategy behind it but also a maintenance and upkeep property management strategy and all those things that come with like large scale capital investment.

[00:04:04] So I mean in doing this research and intuitively knew there's a market there. I mean you have to I mean incomes aren't as rising as fast as rental housing prices are rising so more and more people have to rent and our stress tests are so stringent for people you know buying a house that it you know makes rental the only possibility for many people as well.

[00:04:28] There's always a transient community of people moving in and out so rentals are always going to be there right so we knew intuitively there was market for the objective of their port was to look at really where is the most advantageous market for people to invest.

[00:04:40] So you know where in where housing prices are rising higher than incomes and your population they have a high communities that have a high growth population these are the communities where you know you see the most opportunity for investment.

[00:04:57] And I should know off top my head with a top five or but yeah.

[00:05:04] Exactly some very it's that our two same rate for normal chat them can two same really yeah we were actually lucky enough Samantha with that this is one of the reasons why we love the reports so much so Dan and I are both.

[00:05:17] We fit into that small crap group of investor you say so we've got a small fund ourselves we've got just over 50 units primarily in two of the locations that were in the report which we identified as great markets for a lot of the reasons they were in the report years and years ago so yeah it's fascinating to see the.

[00:05:37] You know a large part of our audience the 70,000 people that listen a month their part of those again they fit into that category of people that you're describing so it's interesting to see kind of the institutional level get into and again you've you've brought up great points on housing affordability.

[00:05:55] And you know the lack of density and I'd love to kind of switch over to maybe again you can speak this from your background municipality zoning you know the design of taking a house and turning it into a multi family can you tell us about some of the next steps that we need to see on both the public and the private sector for for this to start to come in a flourishing a bit more well.

[00:06:21] The public sector has ease and restrictions which make this you know more possible densification of lots makes it's very advantageous to investors so adding laneway sweet garden sweets putting more than one house on a lot all of those things are great you know they do ease the approval zoning construction process etc.

[00:06:44] Unfortunately doesn't ease construction costs which are still prohibitive to a lot of folks investor groups included because those are are I mean even though I think that they've sort of leveled off right now just because of the situation we're in they haven't dipped right so there's still high.

[00:07:01] And we have an enormous trade shortage so even making those things a reality sometimes forces you to go to substandard quality so this is a problem across the board is it solvable immediately no not solvable right now something I think that the community colleges and other trade schools have been working at now for a while but so long term problem we have and if you're on a construction site any given day you'll hear everybody talk about it.

[00:07:31] There's just no traits they're not qualified they do terrible work they have to repeat the work etc so one of the things I do think would be great either from a public investment opportunity or incentives for private would be to really look at what can you do with high quality advanced manufacturing and housing and high quality production builds in in less a build to suit rentals or whatever.

[00:07:59] But advances in construction techniques whether than rather than relying on the lack of skilled trades and just blaming them for the continued problem we really need to invest in this I do not know what that's happening I don't think it is I have not heard it is I haven't heard you know somebody saying let's embrace housing industry and see how we can overhaul how we build houses for 200 years that's what we should do so that's one big thing that's a hold back to I think new housing renovated housing etc.

[00:08:28] Then I'm gosh you ask me what what do I think what is next for now I've already forgotten it.

[00:08:35] That's a yeah no not at all it was it was a lengthy question so I'll go back to the question but before so it was just what we need to see from the public and private sectors to advance this but

[00:08:47] before we go there I really love that point right like the trade shortage the skilled trade shortage is so drastic at this point that even if we were to somehow you know maybe it's maybe it's an immigration policy or something like that but even going to look at the immigration numbers what was it then in queue for something like that in a second half of last year out of the 500,000 immigrants 455 of them were skilled trades so like 0.0

[00:09:17] 1% I mean it's ridiculous so if we're not going to be able to play catch up there where can we make up that ground and you're right if we can have some kind of you know I don't whether it's the modular shipping container or you know slab on grade drop drop in the plate drop in the house kind

[00:09:34] of thing of whatever size I really like that idea right let's focus on prop tech and construction technology versus relying on humans to go get degrees and you know go through their get the red seal to become an electrician that we can trust to go out and you know put the electrical in the houses we need.

[00:09:51] Yes well and I think that you know in most in many cases especially in communities in Ontario you see the same housing types stamped around because it's a product for the post war catalog of houses right which I know now they're reintroducing which I think is a good idea same they could do the same with laneway housing garden suites and maybe that new catalog that CMHC is planning on coming out with we'll do that but building those as components and or

[00:10:20] modular ones is a huge room for I mean we've got a for innovative companies who want to come in and do that and I know of a few that do modular builds and things like that and I myself when I was building houses I looked at a lot of those solutions most modular ones were

[00:10:36] substandard for what I wanted and then some of the ones that were really great quality more expensive than a stick build so we haven't quite gotten that recipe right yet.

[00:10:47] I do think you know if I could wave a magic wand and put together a think tank whatever that would be what I would focus on if I had a lot of money and I wanted to put it towards something that I want to do that.

[00:10:58] As far as like public investment in this institutional rental housing I think it's going to come I think it's inevitable it's just it just makes so much financial sense the the whole the things that may hold it back public perception of institutionalizing rental housing you know this is Canada you know we'd like to believe or I do believe this I'm an American slash Canadian we are the kind of gentler nation we want everybody to have housing.

[00:11:26] You know you don't want to see housing is something that people are profiteering off of etc but housing is a it's been it's been that industry it's been an industry that that has a huge amount of profit in an anyway whether it's construction development etc.

[00:11:42] I do think there are ways though to get around that so there are programs that other companies have in the US where they are renting housing to folks but those house those folks are also involved in the investment company for the housing so it's almost like a build to own or you know you're renting and then you get a percentage of profit in the investment company etc.

[00:12:02] So there's some things I think that that are aligned with the idea of the kind of gentler nation you know that it would be great if some institutional housing would companies if they're large scale would embrace some of these things I know smaller scale companies probably can't afford to do that a larger scale companies could.

[00:12:18] I do think you know if there was a focus on sustainability health and safety all of those things would be great for the community.

[00:12:27] I know as a person who is considered buying property for rental and a lot of my friends you know have bought properties and they rent them on etc.

[00:12:36] It is very hard to do from a landlord perspective you worry constantly you're at risk because what happens if people don't pay their rent so for you know clarifying some of those policies and working with those the landlord tenant board and all those things I think you know should happen as well to make it more advantageous for people to own.

[00:12:57] You know or put a lot of their money into properties to mitigate the risk I'm too scared to do it for that reason I have friends is whose friends who they've had people not pay rent for a year.

[00:13:10] Yeah there's no shortage of horror stories on that side of things that's for sure.

[00:13:14] I think I have the record for the longest of it. I know which was 16 months that I didn't receive rent and it was there's a criminal activity going on at the house and stuff like that so it was not we're constantly getting by law infractions and fines and stuff like it.

[00:13:32] So I mean I understand.

[00:13:35] So it really begs the question and I'll use it to lead into the next question that we have on the list which is you know we the mom and pop investor thing is is a challenge in a place like Ontario there are obviously more landlord friendly areas in in Canada but what is this whole let's call it the financialization of housing or the leading into a more institutional rental like I'm up the opinion that.

[00:14:05] A more corporate structure larger landlords could be it would be beneficial for both the tenant and for the landlord tenant system because they're more qualified in a lot of cases are seeing purpose built rental here in Ontario where.

[00:14:17] You know the builder there the future landlord is the person who built the home so they're exceptionally qualified to be the owner of it but you know broadly what do you think the impacts here are on on the mom and pop investor on the homeowner and on these institutional investors.

[00:14:32] Well I think there's opportunity for for both in the market there's there's option for some of your own spy properties are like yourself 50 properties or an institutional investor comes in and wants to do 200 properties.

[00:14:43] I think you know if an institutional investor can do build to rent communities there's a lot of advantage in that I do mind you as the designer and the designs now I prefer not to see them like rubber stamped around like monopoly houses actually it's a character to them and all that's where you come back.

[00:15:00] All the great planning ideas urban design ideas but I think there's room for that and I like the idea of institutional investors because usually big companies like that can apply pressure to change systematic processes.

[00:15:14] That's what mom and pop companies can't do necessarily or don't have the time to do because usually you know your it's it's it's money don't have the leverage to do let's just be honest so.

[00:15:26] I think if we can get some responsible invest you know large scale capital to do build to rent communities or even if they're used if they're doing scattered site.

[00:15:37] They can apply some pressure to make some things better and maybe they can also contribute some profits to make some things better right so you know back to habitat for humanity or back to some of those other organizations who are advancing affordable housing so there's some there's some advantages to that I do think.

[00:15:55] Though if they are not if they do not have some values and a mission and some policies that are a bit more altruistic that didn't they'll be push back.

[00:16:07] And I think that's just Canadian society in general right back to that kind of kind of generation.

[00:16:13] I think also though if they do embrace those kind of ideas they'll get more uptake I think you know people want to be part of something that does good so maybe I'm just too altruistic or too optimistic but I would like to believe that that's true.

[00:16:27] That they could really make a difference and look we have a housing shortage we're at a tipping point homelessness is out of control formal housing is out of control the more people who are contributing to this solution of this problem the better.

[00:16:42] Yeah I you know we talk about all the time on the show I couldn't agree more we need to see it from like the you know the so called the small cap citizen investors but we need to see it more from from the big players and a lot of them have have you know housing starts are down right like you know our population is growing at all time highs and and housing starts are down.

[00:17:03] So we really do need to see the bigger players getting involved in your right that you know the benefit of being a big player is that you've you've got the ability to influence change whether through lobbying or government relationships or whatever that may be.

[00:17:18] So I think that's a really great point there and again it kind of you know this is all slowly leading us towards again I think you know we talk about a lot a lot on the show as well the renters economy right Canada still such a young country if you look at a lot of the European community.

[00:17:33] And in the European countries homeownership rates are a lot less than they are here so I think I think purpose built rentals I think any kind of incentive or any kind of direction that they can help push this problem push this along and help you know slowly get us out of this problem that we've kicked the can down the road for the last 30 years basically.

[00:17:55] So I think that's a good thing sorry go.

[00:17:57] No I was just going to say add to this we really need some creative thinking around this I mean every time I go into I live a closer Kingston award and every time I go into my Canadian entire which is a Danforth in Maine I think why is it they're not rental apartments above it.

[00:18:12] It makes no sense you know the idea that oh we have to keep spreading out toward you know aren't bill or up toward blue mountain or whatever makes no sense there is opportunity within the city.

[00:18:22] What's holding us back are silly zoning laws you know in a lot of it like you should be able to put rental apartments above commercial property and you got law laws you know and Canadian tired with the biggest companies in Canada sitting on a gold mine so yes large institutional investors for rental housing partnered with some of those rates I think Canadian entire in both law laws have their own rate for their stores could solve a lot.

[00:18:50] I'm not going to waste my life but you know anyway in regards to not mentioning some of these large multinationals in regards to the groups that I think this report was designed for.

[00:19:04] What's the reception been like are our large multinational groups and some of these larger landlords in the state or even builders in Canada responding to the report positively they are expressing an interest in getting more involved in at scale rental ownership in Canada.

[00:19:19] What is the industry response been since you put out this report because I know I've seen it on a bunch of feeds on LinkedIn and Twitter and stuff like that.

[00:19:28] And I know a lot of people are talking about it but I'm curious kind of behind the curtain are you going to emails from people saying help us build a strategy we want to own a billion dollars with a real estate in Canada.

[00:19:40] Well we have gotten quite a few calls. Quite a few calls from investors more like yourself who own 50 units you know 30 units 100 units how can we grow and scale this.

[00:19:51] How can we find investors from other areas as you know there are some tricky things about bringing in money from other countries to invest in housing so that's not an easy solution.

[00:20:03] And this is where our multi family group though in the states really does shine and looking at how we can make some of those things happen so if anybody is listening to this.

[00:20:13] And they are interested in trying to scale up connect with me and I can connect you with our multi family group in the states.

[00:20:20] I think though that rumors are circulating about ones coming in and certainly we saw in the I think it was this week we saw some news about tricon so you know I think that they're they I think it's again I think it's inevitable would be would push me to be happy if we got some work out of it absolutely so if anybody is listening.

[00:20:46] We've got a lot of talented people at kushman who can don't make this happen from getting me financing together and and also figuring out the strategy of where you should build what you should build first so.

[00:20:56] Yeah yeah now it's certainly a lot of talent over at kushman as as you know with this report scene and this report and a lot of others and it's I love to hear that you know I'm sure there will be the bigger players the more institutional level people coming and approach you on this but it's great to hear.

[00:21:11] That the you know small cap investors are our chomp and at the bed to get things done it and you know our audiences is we do have institutional level listeners and clients but a lot of our audiences is that those small cap people across the country.

[00:21:27] And more so than ever now we've been talking them about M.L.I. select because they are now trying to build what you see in H.C.'s product that basically has the best terms and amortization lengths and interest rates on the market so it's just a you know it's interesting to see that that's where the response has been from more so then more so then on the bigger players.

[00:21:50] Well smaller players are more agile so don't forget they're ready to go bigger players more risk you got a lot of things to think about before you jump in so you know generally slower moving and but I do think that within this year we'll see some movement there whether it's from tricon or somebody else or you know hopefully.

[00:22:12] Looking forward to it Samantha thanks so much for for joining us I think this has been a very valuable conversation and again thanks for the great work with you and your team on that report please do the one across Canada so we can cover that and have you guys back on the show I think Dan we even joked about that we're like we have to convince them.

[00:22:32] I've been doing a lot of research on Canada wide stuff so there's any anyway and we have a lot of data science products on that as well so I would be happy to help you out on the coast to coast if there's anything we can do.

[00:22:46] Well let's get started let's do it.

[00:22:49] Yeah absolutely love it.

[00:22:51] Samantha working people getting touch with you find out more about you all that kind of stuff if anyone has any other questions or anything.

[00:22:59] I am so easy to find you just Google Samantha Sonola and it pops up reach out to me on LinkedIn my phone number is pretty public it's you know so they'll find me.

[00:23:09] Love it's okay gosh and will yeah we'll include your LinkedIn and end a copy of the report in the in the show notes.

[00:23:15] Awesome great guys.

[00:23:17] Thanks so much.

[00:23:18] Appreciate your time.

[00:23:19] Bye bye.

[00:23:20] Talk to you soon bye bye.

[00:23:23] That was an awesome interview I was just as impressed with Samantha as I expected to be after reading the report so I'm glad she really knew what she was talking about and exciting kind of towards the end there that maybe we'll get to be involved in the in helping with the research on on the Canada wide side.

[00:23:41] Yeah did we just go into business with with we certainly we certainly try to certainly try so let's see if we make the cut there.

[00:23:48] Can't knock us for trying yet I mean honestly she brought up some seriously good points something that really resonated with me was you know if we can't if we don't have the trades to build these homes what's the easier and better road is it to try to you know import these trades try to really incentivize trades I mean but then again that's going to take years right like I mean.

[00:24:12] Yeah innovation is the easier route and innovation should be deflationary yeah exactly so for her to look at and be like you know we need better construction technology we need butter construction implementation I thought that was really really fascinating for sure on the note of going Canada wide.

[00:24:30] You know we it would be interesting to hear from the audience what they think those Canada wide markets might look like because I will go through it here because they get they provide in the report and I know there was a little bit we didn't get to in the reports or kind of going to finish off today's

[00:24:45] episode with what was missing from from the first episode we did about the report but they provide here this detailed analysis of target Ontario markets

[00:24:53] and I would be really interested to see what this list would look like coast to coast so if you're a listener outside of Ontario because we really don't we want to try and avoid the center of the universe thing and it sounds like Kushman has has a similar objective because you know if they're going to help these institutions achieve scale in rental across the country they really do have to focus

[00:25:14] on take and look at some of the markets where things work really well across the country so send us a message to the show and let us know what city you think should be on this report if it was coast to coast or even if you feel so compelled leave us a review so I'm checking in from Saskatoon and I think it should be included in the Canada wide report so across Ontario they they identified 34 markets somewhere combined

[00:25:36] where they studied within this report to determine the viability of rental housing investment in those markets the criterion that they use was basically median home prices had to be below a million which made the ROI for acquiring renovating and operating single family homes as rental properties to be feasible

[00:25:53] and a win-win for both the operator and the renter and I mean this is something that we talk a lot about in in the course and other things is you know getting that price point down so that you can actually create value and scale

[00:26:05] they have to be located near some sort of major transit corridor facilitating market access migration and access to an attractive employment market so you know be on a highway where you can drive to go to your job which is necessary for a lot of people to pay rent

[00:26:21] at least one connection to a provincial highway or other major transit route so you will see like this is where you don't see an up bridge but you do see a Georgina as an example which is funny because next from up bridge and I'm from Georgina then because I just want to say and like I'll bridge it's a blessing in a curse for a place like up bridge because it's it's far from the highway so you know people really have to want to live there want to live there and you get all these people who just love up bridge

[00:26:46] you know where is Georgina it's like right on the highway so you live there because the highways there you just live there because you drove the highway and it stopped there I go okay well it's under the road

[00:26:56] drive to you qualify I just did it as far as we're going to have to there's no highway left yeah yeah yeah and then yeah it's interesting because a lot of these a lot of the kind of key points that they have here for the analysis of the markets

[00:27:12] exactly what we tell people to look for when we're telling them how to pick a market yeah I know it is well this report has been great for just validating us which is something that we need to do yeah it was really good I was reviewing my 2024 lists of New Year's resolutions and I just basically crossed off the 2023 from last year and changed it to 2024 so I need some validation that was talking about the validation from

[00:27:39] yeah yeah validation from cushion in a wake field was was a specific one on the list that was on the list for this year so run me through what these markets are said that the last pieces of the population had to be greater than 20,000 people for economies of scale so they've identified for primary secondary and tertiary markets so once you start me off with a list of primary markets here Nick.

[00:27:59] yeah there's a lot of them here there's 34 so I'm not going to read all of them but what I'll do is maybe read the top primary do the day primary yeah yeah okay so we primary is made up of Hamilton Kitchen Waterloo London Ottawa,

[00:28:14] Oshua St. Catharines and Welland, Whitby and Windsor.

[00:28:20] And then secondary secondary markets would be Barry Brentford Cambridge Chatham can't Clarington Guelph,

[00:28:28] Canada Kingston, Sarnia, Susaint Marie, Sudbury and Thunder Bay you might as well just read the tertiary market so I guess I'll take that one yeah yeah I was thinking you know 34 it might see if you can do it faster than I did secondary markets which is 12

[00:28:44] Belville Quinty, Bowmanville Newcastle Cornwall and number three Georgina Dan there you go,

[00:28:51] Leamington, Lindsay Corothe as Newt De Cumse, Norfolk County, North Bay Orangeville a really a Peterborough St. Thomas,

[00:28:59] Timons and Woodstock and those 15 make up the tertiary markets.

[00:29:04] I could also be a list of the beautiest towns in Ontario too.

[00:29:07] Just great places every single one of those.

[00:29:10] So should we maybe we'll go through the list here of the top cities as well rank by Stabilized Eeled just as a refresher from from last episode and then the idea of yield on cost

[00:29:21] and then we'll wrap up on the strategies in Ontario.

[00:29:24] Perfect yeah so yeah give me the top cities based on on Stabilized Eeled here.

[00:29:29] Yes a Thunder Bay is coming in at about six and a half Sue St. Marie basically the same thing Chatham Kent were about five and a half Cornwall about five and a half

[00:29:41] and North Bay about five and a half as well.

[00:29:45] I have to say Chatham Kent is one of the most slept on markets honestly especially because of where it is it's like it's very far south the weather is like climate's actually noticeably marginally better.

[00:29:55] I don't know if it is let the night I remember.

[00:29:58] Like one of the like that's like a legacy investment market now it might have kind of skipped like the the covid cycle.

[00:30:05] All the other markets got a lot more track to but I you know I've been following investing there for like a decade but you're right i mean it's something that we don't have a ton of exposure to day but I know there's a bustling investment community down there.

[00:30:18] So if you start buying things we got to put we should just so we can go to go check it out.

[00:30:23] Yeah so we can excuse to visit a city and maybe worth looking at what's next on that list just because I mean not everybody wants to invest in municipalities that are that far away from the core.

[00:30:33] So you know the first you start going down the list and you get to North Bay, Simco Kingston, Essec region auto is probably the first major city auto and then Windsor.

[00:30:44] Another big city yeah and and then if you go to the it changes a little bit when you go to development yield on cost and remember yield on cost is a metric that investors use.

[00:30:54] To calculate a project based on the cost and projected return so it's basically in that operating income divided by the total project cost you know it could be.

[00:31:02] Also call the return on cost or cost cap rate we're going in cap rate but if you look at this development yield on cost you have Susamery Thunder Bay Cornwall.

[00:31:13] North Bay and then Chadum Kent but then you get down to Simco and then you're looking at like a Burlington which is in the GTA which is crazy wild.

[00:31:23] Burlington Kingston Essex region auto up there again and then Tillsonburg Windsor and actually Tillsonburg was next on the previous list as well so couple of cities that are really worth thinking about when you're ranking them kind of bottom to top for sure you top to bottom.

[00:31:39] And I would just really advise anyone to check this report out if you like Samantha said if you search her name on Google you'll find her LinkedIn and there's a bunch of stuff from the report there.

[00:31:51] And hopefully we can we really can contribute to doing something like this on a Canada wide base so it would be such a cool little crossover for the Canadian real estate investor podcast to be doing something with that you know helping to advance the strategies of our listeners so let's talk a little bit about these strategies that they mentioned here Nick.

[00:32:08] Do you want to go through the strategies that that might make sense for people to invest in these markets?

[00:32:15] Yeah for sure so some of the strategies they outlined may include single family rentals in higher growth markets inside the GTA.

[00:32:27] So close to Toronto, Auschwitz is a good example and that's due to the stability of those markets based off their proximity to of course the center of the universe here Toronto.

[00:32:38] Yeah the next on the list would be single family rental in high growth in industry focused markets such as Canada or kitchen or waterloo which could capture capture corporate rentals focused on the tech industry or well paid transient salaried workers.

[00:32:51] You see a lot of this in the US with people investing to medium term rentals for traveling nurses actually.

[00:32:58] Yeah no great point the next one's actually really interesting as well single family in high growth high price to income market so where the prices are a lot prices of housing is a lot more expensive versus how much money people are actually making these

[00:33:16] the use bone in here at Bowmanville here as an example because there are the trends in Bowmanville are increasing on affordability for for home ownership.

[00:33:26] Yeah and then the next one is single family rental in smaller low cost low growth outlier markets such as timons which have high rent floors which I mean timons is a great example because the high that high rent floor and this is where you would start thinking about how this would apply for markets like Alberta as an example or you know I like there's some investors we just got a meetup community.

[00:33:45] We just got a meetup community started in a place like red deer as an example where there's a lot of people working on the on the rigs that are making a lot of like you know really high income right so that sets your red floor high and so you get a high income area with a cheap entry because a lot of those people who are working in those in those markets are more transient or they're not they don't plan to live in that city permanently.

[00:34:07] And so what ends up happening as a result of that is your house price doesn't really go up high because they're not bidding house prices up.

[00:34:14] So you get high rents but a low entry price low so they call it low cost for the high rent floor I mean there's I think there's a lot of examples of that on a coast to coast basis of that strategy being really applicable so.

[00:34:25] Yeah and I mean these are all great strategies so far all stuff that you know we've been doing when we're looking at properties for clients or for our own acquisition.

[00:34:34] So I'd love to see here the final two they've got here is a build to rent so purpose built rentals.

[00:34:40] Cmhc aml i select we've talked about it a million of one times and of course multi family so you know adding units so essentially just increasing density of existing products so really great list of strategies there and again nice to see the validation from from cushion away field on all the stuff we've been talking great way to start the year for sure yeah okay make sure you go and fall and fall and

[00:35:03] follow or reach out to Samantha on LinkedIn or or via email whatever if you have any other questions for her wealth of knowledge make sure you email us if you have any questions for us and go check out the report it will be linked in the show notes.

[00:35:17] Thank you so much for listening as always we'll see you on the next one.

[00:35:22] The Canadian real estate investor podcast is for entertainment purposes only and it is not financial advice.

[00:35:30] Nick Hill is a mortgage agent with premier mortgage center and a partner in the GNH mortgage group license number one zero three one seven agent license M21004037.

[00:35:45] Dino foes is a real estate broker licensed with rare real estate a member of the Canadian real estate association the Toronto real estate board and the Ontario real estate association.